What should the next DR boat be?

[DanH]

OK, its gonna be either a "Large" mad Boy or a "smaller" Critical Mass.

We're still undecided as to which direction to take - the mad Boy is more fun to paddle, but its not the "all out" machine the CM is. The CM is the ultimate "keep you alive through anything" boat, but slower and less "fun) (read: slalom style) to paddle...

Corran

Small Critical Mass please, to replace my Mafia its in need of replacing!

[thegirl]

Too bad

Do you also make single custom made composite boats?

Greets

[chrispedley]

large mad boy would be sweet as-i'd buy one, i often want a boat that is more fun than my critical mass but don't want to go down to a smaller size. make a super speedy nuts zippy river running machine and one that doesn't spend it's time getting backlooped as soon as you take it on a pushy creek and id be well impressed and sold.

good luck

chris.

[DanH]

Chris - Have you paddled the MadBoy? Its pretty big, admittedly not CM size, but I wouldn't have thought you'd need a bigger one!

MadBoy & Critical Mass Data:

[Matt Kurle]

are you planning on making a bigger slalom boat?

[flowmaster]

DID YOU KNOW that almost all other companies have boats that are worse than the boats they build a few years ago (except creekers) and that there is a trend towards building boats that are easy to paddle for almost anybody. Is this where the industry is heading? Is this where DR is heading? To build a boat that allows a beginner to do a 360 or to get down class 3 with almost no skills because the boat is really stable and has much volume? It's a shame that that people who cannot paddle decide which boat is good and which is not good today I wonder how Riot survived in its early years and why they got bankrupt now?

And are there really more fat people ( no offense) than small people that it is impossible to build a smaller volume boat to get a snug fit when you are small... .

Corran, please build a boat for your size.

[tim]

Flowmaster..... I liked your other post but I gotta disagree with you here, Corran designs more than half of his boats for people his size. I have owned a stinger, fish and currently own a pintail, Critical Mass and Thruster. I have paddled a gangster quite a bit and a mafia and squashtail a few times. Out of all the boats, the CM and Thruster are the only real big boy boats. I am 5'9", 205 and not fat; most of the people I paddle with are larger, maybe not as stocky as I am but many of them don't fit into the Fish, Stinger, Squashtail or Mafia and barely fit into the Pintail with the seat in the appropriate position for my 31" inseam. And in case you're going to chime in and call me a big wuss.....it wasn't just how comfy I was (although I like to be as comfy as possible in my boats)

I sunk the crap out of the Stinger, Fish, Mafia and Squashtail (although the ST was OK once it got up to speed on a wave). The Gangster was a bit small for my taste. I haven't paddled the Madboy but it looks slightly small for my size and the bigger water creeking we have in the pacific NW.

In addition, I think most companies don't have boats that are worse than they were a few years ago; The JK Star series is better than pre 2007, the LL Biscuit is better than the Space Cadet and Airhead; I like the Nemesis better than the Flirt series....

-Tim

[flowmaster]

Hi Tim,

to fit in a kayak means different things to different people. Most people I know don't sit in their boats as they should, they lack boat contact a lot and still complain their boat is too small. Most people don't like snug fit and when I say snug fit I mean that you can feel the boat around your whole upper leg. The less volume and the lower the deck profile the better the fit and also important a seat like a power seat and a short narrow cockpit. Most people complain that they don't have enough space for their feet but thats not true I think. In a playboat or a riverrunner you cannot expect to paddle with upright feet like in a creeker and many people are used to that. I am way taller than many people and fit in boats those people claim are way too small for them and I even outfit my seat with foam and I also have larger feet size. Snug fit doesn't mean discomfort, the opposite is true, it is more comfortable because it is less exhausting to paddle. The 47 volume boats from Riot were perfect for me and any most people who really can paddle and have normal size got a good fit from those boats ( Air45, Booster 50, Dominatrix47,Turbo 47). All DR boats have much more volume than the previously mentioned boats. The Mafia, ok, it is a really small creeker for small people you are right. The Squash is a different thing alltogether because of its narrow front shape and hull you need more volume to get space for your upper legs. But all other boats are way oversized especially for small and mid-sized people. I am 1.80 meters tall with fairly long legs, Foot size 43 1/2 European. A playboat with less volume paddles like a much shorter boat than a boat with the same lenght but with more volume. You can also use the ends to better jumps in and out of eddies, turn, and so on with much less power. The boats gets lighter because you don't carry around unnecessary volume plastic. For the European market less volume is far better. As for the other boats you mentioned i think you are right they are an improvement but their predecessors already were build for the general consumer and not as a high end playboat except for some surf specific designs.

[chrispedley]

Don't flash your post it's at me mr H!
Length-wise it may not be smaller by much but the volume is smaller-I'm a heavy bugger and even a Nomad 8.5 i find "dips" too much for my liking...or maybe i've just been paddling my CM for too long...

Funny you should post that pic Dan....was just flicking through some old pics and found this in my first CM.....

[DanH]

Nice pic Chris, how was the landing?

Anyway, back to the next DR boat, what do people really want?

I don't know what I want anymore... Perhaps we want something totally novel and new. Where is kayaking going next, what the next big step? Lets make it!